Q&A with Holistic Scientist

Apr 02, 2017

Aspirant: Dadaji, could you explain what Sanskar means?

Holistic Scientist: Sanskar does not mean virtues as is generally understood. There is no equivalent word for it in English. But you will understand what it means as we explain it to you.

Sam-kaar
means all activities are balanced. And one who is balanced, normal, in all the activities of life, in all relative living and in all the relative aspects, is Sanskari. Do you follow?

It is extremely difficult to understand Sanskar. That is the puzzle and that I exactly what distributed Arjun for he had no knowledge of this. And why is it he had no knowledge? Because the vision that is required for such knowledge was not there. Even though he had been with Lord Krishna all his life and at that particular point of time in front of Him, yet he was puzzled. Faced with the situation of having to fight his own kinsmen, he was put in a dilemma. Lord Krishna understood his problem & explained to him that the situation demanded that as a Sanskari, he should be very alert and not waste any time or he would be finished as war was already declared. Had war not been declared, it would be a different thing.

But Arjun continued to be puzzled. How can one be active in any relative activity and at the same time be balanced? Then Lord Krishna explained the state of a balanced human being to him. Now a human being with a balanced state! How can one be balanced in each and every situation when the only instrument one has to deal with the situation is intellect. What? Tell me.

Aspirant: Intellect.

Holistic Scientist: Definitely. All over the world, intellect is the only measurable instrument one has with which one as to be balanced. And that instrument itself has to be stable. Unless that instrument is stable, how can one be balanced? At that time, the intellect had some balance. But if for Arjun it was difficult to live as per his intellect, how could it be easy for an ordinary person? Lord Krishna continued to explain. And finally the time came when Arjun, having realized the limit of his own understanding power that was intellectual based, surrendered and begged of Lord Krishna to show him his ultimate form (divine state). So, the ultimate form was shown and he exclaimed. ‘Oh! Behold! Behold! Behold! ‘

He was awe struck on seeing his form, not in the sense of stature and size. He saw the form of that Absolute Divinity within, with powers of infinite and perpetual nature unfolded in a body without egoism. A live body without egoism is that Absolute form in this limited body frame. Do you follow? A live body without egoism! That is what he saw. And yet Lord Krishna was living with everybody like a friend. Nobody could understand that he had such powers within. But to know that, you have to have that inner Divine vision.

But for the people to understand such a form and god be fearing in life, one has o be shown and explained such a form, stature wise, dramatically, with so many heads, so many hands and all those things.

Aspirant: So God doesn’t have so many heads?

Holistic Scientist: No! God doesn’t have so many heads. This form is for those who have no realization of God and God’s form, His potentiality and powers, infinite powers. Till one gets self realization, one has to be god fearing keep fear of God in mind & live life. If the cops are removed and full freedom given, what will be the state?

Aspirant: There will be chaos.

Holistic Scientist: Chaos! People will play havoc. So cops are needed. Similarly, for the people, depending on their stages of development, to be blessed with an easy life, a smooth life, they have to be God fearing & rely on Him. That is why God is shown to man as someone with stature.

But the true stature of Lord Krishna was that He experienced himself in every living creature, whether visible or invisible. And that was the vision, Sanskar, that the Lord Krishna gave to Arjun. Do you understand, Vikram? And you? (referring to his fiancée). So your marriage is fixed for the 18th of July? Very good. My blessings are with you. Our Sanskar are such that in spite of being bound by marriage, though dependent on each other throughout life, both of you will experience independence. That is the state… It is not the Woman’s Liberation Movement that can give independency to women. No!

There were times when women could not read scriptures. They could not read the Vedas. There were certain reasons and certain social adjustments required. But how can rules that are subject to time and period be made into permanent laws? See how people lose their own independence on so many man created laws and other things as per social requirements. Not that it is bad. It is good. But there are certain limits within the frame of which everybody has to be understood. It is not that females are inferior to males. No! No! No! Not at all. Both have equal right to realize and experience the mighty and total blissful state of God and that too within oneself, not outside. And therefore in search of God, one has to go within, not wander outside. Within means one has to go deep, to the core of the heart.

And Jesus is there at the core of the heart. It is not that Jesus has died. No! Jesus himself had said that ‘We’ are there and Resurrection is referred to in this sense. Vision, do you follow? And the location of Jesus, His life and way of living is at heart. He was a living example to the world in his times of a human being with heart. For Him, nobody was his enemy. Though one has to face so many contradictory situations in life, yet at heart one can be totally impartial. But today, because of the hard and complex times, to live, by heart, principle wise is very difficult. Today, nobody can trust anybody. But oh! What a wonder of Nature that in such difficult times, you have a live form before you in whom you can have trust just on seeing Him and such a live form can only be a self-realized state, in its total experience. Though He is before you, eating, speaking, participating in all the worldly activities like everyone else, yet HE is not in any of these worldly activities, totally free (separate) like a dry coconut kernel from the shell.

Aspirant: Dadaji, when you were talking of Arjun with Krishna, you mentioned that at the time, Arjun was not aware of the Pure Soul. The issue was that he had a problem in entering the battle because of his emotions. So in today’s context, we always have the same battle.

Holistic Scientist: Like?

Aspirant: Like where do we draw the line because a lot of times, we have to stretch a lot…

Holistic Scientist: In short, I will tell you. It is the crux, the basic point. That means one has to live life with the drawn line, the border line, the dissociating line. Do you follow? But that line is not physical and yet it is there. And the subtlety, the divinity and the powers of what is within are here. It’s the line of demarcation between the Relative and the Real.

To have knowledge of the Relative perfectly as well as knowledge of oneself as Real, Shuddhatma, which is perpetual with infinite powers, infinite vision, infinite knowing power, that is true knowledge.

But worldly knowledge in relative terms is based on intellect. The sharper the intellect, the sharper the knowledge. The sharpness of an intellectual person surpasses that of an ordinary person who understands this knowledge of the Real at a much later stage depending on his intellectual state within. But after all, it is intellectual power only and it is physical. But though physical, it is not something that the medical science can examine to understand it. It is physical in the sense that it is part and parcel of the whole physical existence. But unfortunately, understanding this knowledge of the Real has always been a puzzle in good times as well as adverse times.

In good times too, everybody tries to solve the puzzle through the medium of intellect only. But how can intellect help when one is puzzled? But as the understanding grows, one realizes more and more that one is caught in a puzzle, which is making one dependent on so many things. In fact, this bonded state gets understood in each and every facet of life. And that experience (of the bonded state) particularly comes in adverse times when all one’s reliance on intellect fails. Then one remembers God and takes the solace of prayer. Prayer has a great impact, let me tell you. Even though one is with intellect, it does not matter. But the whole irony is that prayer and intellect never go together. Never! Prayer always has to be from the heart and the difference between the head and the heart is here.

 Now only a self-realized Soul, a “Holistic Scientist”, who has perfect knowledge of the qualities of the Relative and the Real and who is always on the Real aspect side, God aspect side, with Godly virtues, Godly qualities in spite of living in the Relative field (mind, speech, body assembly), can implant you on the Real side by destroying all the relative belief aspects which you believed to be Real and open out your Real vision. This can happen only as long as the “Holistic Scientist” is alive. The moment He is not there, then you have to rely on indirect means by way of scriptures, books or whatever activities can help you.

But whatever may be the indirect means, they are of limited power because the body medium, which is taking the help of these means, is itself in disarray, i.e. not in unison by head, by heart & by behavior. By head means at mind level, by heart means at speech level and by behavior means activities at gross body level. So in the absence of such a unified function of the whole body, as a unified aspect, as a unified live means, one has to resort to so many other means for one to be stable within and this is very difficult. That is why Lord Krishna said that only in the presence of a self-realized person is there, that you have a solution to this puzzle.

When Lord Krishna’s state opened out, it was a transitional time. Even though times were good, i.e. mind, speech, body were in unison, negative forces were taking over the positive forces. And today, when times are bad and there is no unison of the mind, speech, body assembly, the Holistic Scientist’s state, Dada’s state, has opened out.

Aspirant: Dadaji, in the context of Arjun, he passed through various situations before he ended up with the decision to enter war. But when he actually came on the battlefield, he could forsee the dire consequences of war and then went back on his decision to fight.

Holistic Scientist: No! That means he did not understand Dharma as it is. That is the point. Do you follow, Ranjitbhai?

Aspirant: I am following but…

Holistic Scientist: No! Dharma, to know Dharma as it is, is a totally different thing. That is where Arjun failed because his understanding of Dharma was based on intellect and the aspect of intellectual understanding (emotional aspect) of Dharma is not Dharma.

Unable to comprehend what Lord Krishna was explaining to him. What his Dharma demanded, Arjun ultimately surrendered and then Lord Krishna bestowed Grace on him, destroyed all his belief aspects on the Relative side which he believed as Dharma and his state as his perpetual aspect was established within him. And having done that, he left Arjun to decide what he had to do.

We have not gone through the Gita nor read any scriptures. Yet, if you put any scripture in the world before us, we can see them through and through and reveal what exactly had happened at that time. We can visualize those times and those aspects now, be it the times of Jesus, Buddha, Lord Krishna, anyone, just anyone. You too can do so but for that you have to spend some time with us and everything will be O.K. But today we have to talk to Dona and all these people.

Come, come, Dona, ask whatever questions you have.

Aspirant: I am going through difficult times. I had a relation with someone for four years. We had a baby. But the relationship has ended and I am having trouble moving house.

Holistic Scientist: Would you like to taste, experience independency within you in situations where you feel depressed or in certain aspects of life that you might face in the future? I can make you experience independence from all those forces. But that desire to get freedom from the puzzles and problems of life has to come from the bottom of your heart. Right? But what price will you pay for it? You are charging for your portraits, isn’t it?

Aspirant: I paint pictures of angels to spread the idea of spirituality.

Holistic Scientist: In India too, there are painters who want to show that such is the brilliant light at the end of the long, dark tunnel. But pictures are pictures after all, and ‘you’ are ‘you’ as Pure Soul within, how can the pictures be seen? So because of your certain natural gift that is carried forward from your past life into this life and that little clarity which is within, you can draw the pictures.

Aspriant: Yes, I know it’s a gift.

Holistic Scientist: So for artists, players, dramatists, musicians, scientists, for all of them, it is like this. But a real artist with a natural gift is one who never compromises art in terms of money. The same goes for a great author too.

Aspirant: That’s why I don’t make much money…

Holistic Scientist: It will come when the time comes. The coming and going out aspect of money is something that is subject to certain natural laws. Do you understand? But people are ignorant of this. Certain people amass wealth in spite of not working hard or by unfair means; and honest, sincere, hard working people don’t many any money. These times are such. One can say that today’s time is parole time, a temporary, brief period for people to live life with certain means of happiness created due to the advancement of technology on  the physical side. What does Parole mean. Ranjitbhai?

Aspirant: Parole? To  be…

Holistic Scientist: To be out of prison for a limited period.

Aspirant: Temporarily.

Holistic Scientist: Then back into prison.

Aspirant: Depending on your behavior.

Holistic Scientist: Life is like this but people don’t realize this. For  you, money and everything else will also come. But you must remember that all this is a coming and going aspect. But the experience of your blissful state is perpetual; it can never go. It is not subject to destruction or change.

Ranjitbhai, the answer to your query is in those 5 sentences only. Those 5 sentences can unfold infinite powers within you. But these being adverse times, that infiniteness cannot open out to its fullest extent, the Absolute state. Yet, you can experience those infinite powers within you to the extent of 14th phase of the Moon, but not the Full Moon. Can you trace the difference between the 14th phase of the Moon and the Full Moon?

Aspirant: It’s the phases of the Sun.

Holistic Scientist: No questions of the Sun. We are talking of the moon now. The Moon and Sun are totally different. It’s not the phases of the Sun. It’s the phases which are relative that go on operating on the physical aspects and which makes us see the Moon as waning and waxing. For 15 days waxing then waning. Do you follow? So in waxing period, when out of the Dark Moon, then first phase, second phase, third phase, like that up to the 14th phase, your infinite state can open out. But because of the time factor, the 15th phase cannot open out. So the 15th phase is here, Simandhar Swami, Absolute Vitarag and the 14th phase is here, Dada Bhagwan, though He is no more. But ‘WE’ are now here in HIS place. Though forms are different, yet the state is the same. But we cannot take credit for it. No! It’s HIS grace and yet experience is ours. You too, can achieve this state. I have not put any conditions that you have to do this or do that. After this realization of the liberated state within, you have been made free to live life fully, keeping in mind those 5 sentences given to you as Agna. Even though you have to live in this world amongst people with diverse opinions, yet you can remain opinion free and experience your blissful state. Do you follow? You can achieve this state by living as per the 5 sentences given.

I give you 2 viewpoints. Which is the 1st on? By Relative viewpoint, I am Ranjit and the 2nd one is that by Real viewpoint, I am Shuddhatma. So why are these 2 viewpoints given as Agna? Because whatever taste you are experiencing within in a realized state is through our Grace and not due to your own efforts. Grace is required because in these times, your body medium is not in unison and therefore to follow your body medium along with other people’s body mediums and at the same time remain stable within, is difficult.

And a stable person, even with such non-unified body aspects, the  more he progresses, the more humble he becomes. In spite of his knowledge of the Real and his understanding and experienced state within, because of his inner humility, his attitude is such that, “Oh! I am nothing. I don’t know anything.” But ordinary folk cannot understand his inner, humble state. Even for saints and sages, high sages to have such a humble state is very rare.

In the time of Lord Rama, there was only one Maharshi and that is why he was called Maharshi. Amongst all  the  Rushis he was called Maha Rushi. Rushi  is a state, a high state. So to be in the state of Maha Rushi, it is… He was the Guru of all. Yet, he was so simple at heart. In spite of all his powers, because that realization aspect was lacking, what he felt within was “Oh! Bondage! Bondage! Bondage!” He was truly in search of a higher up. Higher up, in the sense, not in Relative terms, but in terms of an Absolute, one who is free from all bondages, i.e. a “Holistic Scientist”. And he did come across one and through his Grace, he got self-realization.

Maharshi Vashishtha, in turn, bestowed Grace on King Rama, who also was of a high stature, and that is how he got transformed from King Rama to Lord Rama.

Holistic Scientist: So Ramesh, you and Shashikant are friends?

Mahatma: Yes, we are friends.

Holistic Scientist: What is the definition of a friend?

Mahatma: Somebody we know intimately to a certain degree, with whom you feel comfortable and somebody who respects our limitations.

Holistic Scientist: If he insults you?

Mahatma: Well, I guess… we forget. We learn to forgive friends more than other people.

Holistic Scientist: Is it?

Mahatma: I think so.

Holistic Scientist: In any situation?

Mahatma: Ah! Well! You are pushing it too far.

Holistic Scientist: That is the test. The test is there. Right?

Mahatma: A friend is someone in whose house you can fill the plates.

Holistic Scientist: That’s true. A friend is a great word, a very great word. Amongst all the relationships is a worldly life, a friendship relation is above all. And this relationship can be found only between a mother and a child. A mother’s friendship with children us the real friendship you must have such an ideal aspect before you to understand what a friendship is. A father cannot be as good a friend to a child as a mother can be. Do you follow? That means in a friendship aspect, there cannot be calculation of any sort that you can find only between a mother and child. However, a child may behave against a mother or parents, yet a mother’s love towards the child is always in favor of the child, without any sort of expectation whatsoever. Isn’t so?

Mahatma: Yes.


Holistic Scientist: That is in worldly life. Similarly, in God’s realm, to experience God’s bliss, there has to be a live body in front of you, a self-realized Soul, a “Holistic Scientist”. Just as a mother’s love for a child is supreme in all the relative considerations, similarly, a Holistic Scientist’s love transgresses all the relative aspects. He identifies himself with every living creature in the whole world. He is in unison with all. Even with a fly that sits on him or an insect that bites him. He experiences oneness because his state is a pupil like state with everybody. He learns a lesson from the insect not to bite anyone.  

Whatever physical suffering comes to any human being, can come to such a high state also. Wherever there is a body, anything can happen to the body. There is a definite account behind all these happenings. Perfect account and real accountancy of life and accountability of life lies here. Dona, do you understand?

Our relative, worldly life is dependent on so many aspects. Yet everybody’s life accounts and its accountability is subject to one’s own doing only. You cannot blame anyone else for what happens to you. You cannot say, “Oh! He did this to me.”

We are explaining this science to you in such simple terms but there is great depth behind this. The depth of the Pacific is nothing. What is the depth of the Pacific

Mahatma: 30 miles.

Holistic Scientist: Whatever it is, but it is nothing before this.

Imagine you are in the middle of the Pacific Ocean. How would you feel? But if you are picked and placed in the shallow waters where your feet touch the floor, how confident would you feel. This is what happens when you get self realization. And once that Divine Vision opens out, when you can see all the intricacies involved in living life, how life is dependent on so many aspects, the complexity of the human body etc, then you will realize that the depth of the Pacific Ocean is nothing; the Everest is nothing, the Titanic experience is nothing. Mountains, ravines, valleys, icebergs, whatever you see, all these things, all these experiences are within you only. So this accountability of life’s happenings is individual, based on one’s projections.

So now you can realize the importance of being a human. Though you find differences nation wise, belief wise, but basically the human form is there and being human, certain qualities have to be there. So what those qualities should be needs to be well understood today. Outwardly, people show that they are concerned about their fellow beings, but often it is not so. Isn’t it ironical that laws are laid down only for human society? In any other realm, there are no laws. These plants, these creatures don’t need any laws. They don’t need maternity homes. They don’t fall sick. They are one with Nature.

Actually, whatever came out in the vision of an original scientist, by way of natural gift, is being applied by today’s scientists in a very negative manner. Whatever research they do, the outcome is mainly focused on monetary returns and scientific dominance over the world. They don’t even know what they are heading for and fear is constantly lurking within. Hence, it would be better if they did research on the relative aspects of life to find ways and means so that people at large, feel peace within. But unless they realize the account and accountability aspect of worldly life, they cannot do research. And this applies to each and every individual who wants to go deep in the science of life.